Not sure where I fit

[Civet]

Sometimes I feel as though I don't really fit here, I guess I have a bit of disconnect from you all for some reason. I feel this way in situations in my "real life" also, so I don't think it's something you are all doing so much as it's something happening with me.

This isn't one of those posts where I say I'm leaving and wait for everyone to tell me not to go, that's just silly. I just am wondering if you all think I honestly fit in here or not. What you say won't influence me to stay or go, as I'm not really thinking of leaving now, I'm just trying to figure out what's going on.

Sometimes I wish I could respond to people better, both here and in real life, but in many situations I just can't find anything to say, or I can't think of how to say what has come to mind. Or I end up just saying something that at the time I think is related, but when I think back on it, probably doesn't make much sense in relation to the topic at all because I failed to make the connections there.

I think part of my reluctance here, at least, comes from the lack of diagnosis, which makes me hesitant to identify as aspie or autistic or whatever. Some of you seem quite assured in your self-dx, while others are a bit more like me and hesitant to self-dx at all.

In any case, this is part of the reason I left for a time, though I ended up coming back anyway. I hadn't planned to leave entirely, I just felt myself drifting a bit and made the decision to take a break from this place for awhile.

I'm not sure what I'm trying to get at here. Sorry, lately I think I've been having a bit of a problem with that.. just sort of going on with no point, or not getting to the point if I have one . But I guess, what are your thoughts?

[SomethingElse]

I'm not really sure how people here 'fit' because a lot of us don't even have that much in common, really. We're all different ages, from different places, with different tastes and areas of interest...

I think I've mentioned before that I don't feel an affinity with other autistic individuals, any more than I do with 'NT' individuals. Before I was diagnosed this was a bigger deal to me, and most of the time I was here trying to work out whether I was likely to be diagnosed at an assessment. Now I'm more relaxed, so it could just be that it's the lack of a diagnosis that's making you feel this way.

This is, however, the forum I do 'best' on out of the five I have been a member of (one of which doesn't exist, one of which I left because I had a stalker there and one of which I rarely visit) I feel as though I give off the least bad impression here. I think it's because, although I don't particularly feel I actually 'fit' I know that I'm less judged here?

There are a group of people I see as 'being Gestalt' and you are one of them.

Sometimes you can be accepted without fitting, and although I have had that experience quite often (I always tend to be accepted rather than actually fitting, when I am accepted) I feel most comfortable here. Most accepted here. I don't have to live up to any expectations here.

I'm not sure if any of that was helpful and I can't say for sure whether my feeling of 'not fitting' is the same as yours or even similar at all, but those are my thoughts on the subject.

Even if there were people here who weren't diagnosable, if they relate enough to AS to have come here then that's enough for them to be 'acceptable' isn't it? Semi-aspie, an aspie cousin, whatever, if you relate to AS then you do relate to 'us'.

I just finished 'The Tommyknockers' and I was thinking about how, by description, it's not really surprising that people expect all aspies to be the same... And then I thought that it would be pretty scary and ever so boring if we all were. Although it's helpful having people here who can relate to some of my issues and who can give advice is helpful, I also still want to be just me, instead of part of the 'Autistic Club'.

I'm not sure if most of that was even relevant, thinking on it, but never mind. In my defence I have actually come over quite dizzy writing this.

[Iam]

Well, everyone here at Gestalt probably knows I went for a diagnosis, and was denied. (I still have doubts and questions about that, incidentally.) Nevertheless, no one has expressed any concern about my continuing to post here. I feel very welcome, although I confess an inability to really discern what other people are feeling or thinking, at least until I cause some type of extreme reaction.
I have never felt myself to be a member of any group or clique. I have always felt myself, if I thought anything about it at all, as an outsider who temporarily associates with members of a group or clique. I have always been apart, even from the people who have been very involved in my life, and that even includes my immediate family. I do not understand the underlying dynamics of that aspect of myself, but I do recognize that it is how I am and have always been.
All that said, I find visiting here interesting and comforting. I enjoy reading each individuals posts, and I do believe I have derived real benefit in doing so.

[Aspen]

I think that feeling sort of set apart from others, like you don't really fit in somewhere is quite often part of having an ASD. So is not knowing what to say. That happens to me a lot, so I probably say the wrong thing even though I mean well.

For what it's worth, I think that all three of you fit in here at least as well as I do. I think the world of you. I think that it's great that we can all be so different and yet so much the same in so many ways.

[goddessoflubbock]

I have always enjoyed your posts civet, and as you can see in the journals and everywhere else here, sometimes a response takes a thread in a whole new direction anyway!

As for fitting in, when I first joined here I rarely posted - I felt it was more a forum for dx'd adults (self dx or otherwise) and that as a "mommy" I didn't fit in.

To this day there are threads I certainly don't feel a need to post in, they aren't relevant to me or my situation, and I can't offer any good information or insights. But I like to think that where I post does some good. I certainly see that as the case with you - I was hoping you'd return when you last left.

As Benji said, we are quite a diverse group - in age, geography, and life experience. Which is what makes it quite interesting here. I belonged to a mommy board at one time. I fit far less there than I do here. As far as spectrum issues go, I've not posted anywhere but here in months.

I guess if I stood back and look at how different I am from most of you (I'm older than most if not all, I'm the mom not the one with a dx, etc) I'd feel like maybe I don't belong. But it's always better to look at the positives - the fact that on a place like this age doesn't matter (yippee ); that the group of people we have here are very welcoming and friendly, willing to give you good ideas on any subject, even unrelated to ASDs, that it's a nice place to be, and it we would lose one more voice if yours were to go silent.

Just my .02. (Hmm, looks more like .04...)

[beware_the_sluagh]

I thought I'd just answer without reading anyone else's replies yet

I always thought you were one of the "in-crowd" here, when I arrived. And I haven't started to not think that.

I'm not really sure of my self-dx either. But, what the hell. I like it here. I often feel I say something totally stupid, and I'm thinking "great, now everyone will think I'm a moron/rude/obnoxious." But, I'm trying to just go with it and not worry.

So I think you fit in well, and the things you've said that I've read have not seemed inappropriate or unrelated. A lot of posts just come from what a person thinks when they read the previous post, even if they're not obviously directly related, and it is interesting to see what other people think. So don't worry about that - it is probably not as disconnected as you think, and in any case it is probably still interesting.

Not having anything to say is sometimes a good thing - it means you don't clutter up the world with rubbish. I reply to anything with the first thing that comes into my head. I actually love talking, but don't have many people to actually talk to "in real life" (and they're not interested in what I say either). But sometimes I think I say too much and too many pointless things. So NOT SAYING things is actually a POSITIVE.

Sometimes, even a lot of the time, it is hard to express oneself, or to put thoughts into words. I think that for many people here that would even be normal. Some people also find it harder to write than talk, or vice versa. So if you find it hard to say something, that is just who you are. I have always found that which you have said to be intelligent and interesting.

Not everyone is the same on Gestalt, so no one fits perfectly. I'll sometimes see something in Benji or hesperus or whoever that is JUST like me - whereas everything else about them is totally different to me. So I identify differently at different times. Also, sometimes there is a thread where I don't have anything to say or where I don't share the same experience as others commenting. So I don't fit in so much to those discussions, but have been involved more in others.

Maybe you enjoy reading other people's posts more than commenting? You are still participating and present - it's just not too obvious in an online community that someone is there if they don't say anything

[beware_the_sluagh]

Ok, I've read the other posts now, on with the compulsive posting

I like what people have said about everyone here being different. That is the best thing! That's what makes it like a group of friends rather than an "Aspie Club" or something. It's just some people who thought "hey, it's cool here, maybe I'll stick around". That's how we can actually have a conversation without everyone parroting everyone else.

[hesperus]

I always thought you fitted in well here. I know the feeling of not being able to connect, though, even on here. I suppose it's part of ASC (or whatever a person labels it). I often feel stupid posting here without an official dx, but somehow keep needing to anyway. I don't post anywhere else because it's just too uncomfortable. Even here I automatically assume I'm an outsider--maybe it's just a lifelong habit. Like offline, I'm always wondering when I'm going to inexplicably cause people to reject me or get rid of me. I've never fit into a group so don't tend to have very high expectations anymore, but here's the easiest group to be with because people share many of the same differences. I always perceived you as fitting in much better than me.

[Civet]

Thank you all for your responses, I've been reading them throughout the day, you all have brought up very good points.

I think Benji said that here she feels like she doesn't have to worry so much about how others think. I feel a little bit like I do do that here, and it may be because like you said, Benji, the not having the diagnosis thing. I'm not sure though. I think maybe I should try to relax a little, though in that regard, which is to say, to be a bit less worried about saying or doing the wrong sort of thing. You are all a very accepting bunch and it's kind of silly of me to not realize that and behave accordingly.

Also, Benji, you often seem to think your posts aren't relevant, you always tend to have sort of a disclaimer at the end, but I think most of the time you don't need to worry about that, because what you've said is perfectly relevant

Goddess, I always tend to think of you as being a bit of a unique voice on here, not to say we aren't all rather different in the first place, but your perspective is quite a bit different from many of ours and I find that both refreshing and interesting. I think it helps to have a slightly more outside view on some of the issues here, and you seem to be very good at seeing things from both an NT and an ASD perspective.

Sluagh- You thought of me as one of the "in-crowd"? Hahaha it's a really funny thing to read, as I've never been in an "in-crowd" in my entire life. Sorry, I don't mean that to be insulting, it just kind of made me chuckle to myself. I guess it's nice to be perceived that way, though I don't feel like there really is an "in-crowd" here, since the forum is rather small, everyone who posts *is* the "in-crowd" to me.

I guess I've just been feeling pretty distant and disconnected and it's more an internal thing than an external one. I'm certainly happy to read that most of you seem to think that even if we don't all "fit" together, we all sort of belong here anyway, and that also includes me.

It seems like many of you all feel like the "outsider" on the fringes also. It's kind of funny to have all these "outsiders" making up the group, like we all just sort of wandered in accidentally and started talking to each other.

And there I go again, I'm not even sure what I'm trying to say anymore. I think I've just been feeling kind of down on myself, which happens from time to time, and it has extended here also. I feel like there's more that I want to convey, but I can't get a clear grasp on it, just writing this message has been a bit of an effort and I don't think things have come out totally right, but hopefully whatever this mental block is it will eventually clear up a bit.

[adhocisadirtyword]

It's interesting that you bring this up because I've been feeling disconnected lately myself. Though with me I think it is more in just response to all of social requirements and I'm pushing back on everything because I just kind of don't want to deal with people through any medium.

Though that doesn't necessarily sound like what you're going through - just noticed that particular wording in your post.

So from a standpoint of fitting in - I think Dx or no Dx, you fit here within our general them of non-judgmental, overly pedantic, different people with different backgrounds and different perspectives. You always add insight and I have to say that I really enjoy reading your posts and often even go to the posts that you've replied to first (had no idea you were so popular, huh?). Since I don't always have time to read all of the posts, I figured that if you took the time to reply to it, it is probably valuable.

Don't mean to make you self-conscious... it's hard to describe in a way that doesn't sound a bit creepy I suppose, but I honestly don't mean it that way. More of just a filter - such as if you only have limited time to read books, you might want to read ones that certain people recommended first. I know that those posts you take the time to reply to are probably really worth reading through in detail.

[SomethingElse]

It seems like many of you all feel like the "outsider" on the fringes also. It's kind of funny to have all these "outsiders" making up the group, like we all just sort of wandered in accidentally and started talking to each other.

That made me think of some Rancid lyrics: "Misfits and homeless kids all call their home there, don't tell me it ain't real don't you f*cking dare."

I remember reading an article where Davey Havok (I'm pretty sure it was him but it was a long time ago, if it's not him then I apologise but I always associate it with him) said that he got into the punk scene because he was a misfit and it seemed that all the misfits gravitated towards the punk scene and were accepted. It was the only place that would accept them.

I guess that in a way Gestalt is a haven for us misfits.

And there I go again, I'm not even sure what I'm trying to say anymore. I think I've just been feeling kind of down on myself, which happens from time to time, and it has extended here also.

I haven't gotten that feeling and had it extend to Gestalt in a long time, but I am currently going through a similar patch myself. I won't clog up this thread with that story... in fact I think I'll go vent in my journal about it now.

I think that it's very easy to experience 'misfitting' as rejection. It doesn't matter whether you'd like to fit in or not, or whether you want friends or a community around you or not, it's still ego-damaging to be/feel rejected. I'm not sure if this does actually apply in the context of how you are down on yourself lately, but that's what came to my mind when thinking over the situation how I assumed you were experiencing it.

[beware_the_sluagh]

It seems like many of you all feel like the "outsider" on the fringes also. It's kind of funny to have all these "outsiders" making up the group, like we all just sort of wandered in accidentally and started talking to each other.

That is funny, a group of people, all of whom are on the fringes of... well, we're on the fringes of something that doesn't even exist here.

And there I go again, I'm not even sure what I'm trying to say anymore. I think I've just been feeling kind of down on myself, which happens from time to time, and it has extended here also. I feel like there's more that I want to convey, but I can't get a clear grasp on it, just writing this message has been a bit of an effort and I don't think things have come out totally right, but hopefully whatever this mental block is it will eventually clear up a bit.

NOW who's adding disclaimers? Don't worry about it. You can write whatever you want in your posts, even if you don't know what it is you're trying to say! With fuzzy feelings like this, there is no direct way to express it. At least, there are very few people who can come up with the phrase or analogy that fits. So you just have to waffle around it, if need be, to get the message across.

[renaeden]

Civet I wondered why you hadn't posted much lately.

For me, not fitting in here is being Australian and not writing long posts and not making sense sometimes. Not having any talents and things like that.

I like you and I like your art and I like to read your posts.

[Sophist]

I have always felt on the periphery. I feel comfortable here. But then I still feel individual. But I like how you put it Civet, wandering in accidentally and just start talking to each other.

As for this forum, to me, even the lurkers who only post once a millenium still feel as though they are present. I think because people are all so different, and while the loud ones might be the most obvious, the quiet ones are still there. That's how the world is, and Gestalt reflects that. For me, it is not so much out of sight out of mind.

And I've always thought of you as part of the community, both this one and on WP (since I knew you first there). Part of the broader community.

I hope one day you'll start feeling more comfortable with your self-dx. It's hard to gain that confidence.

But know that Gestalt, yes, is an autism-based forum, but everyone is welcome, autistic, self-dxed, or nonautistic. Because I like people based on who they are and not a label. (There's plenty of autistics I'd love to toss over Niagra Falls as well as nonautistics and then there's both autistic and nonautistics I really get along with.) Gestalt will never turn away, ignore, or ostracize anyone, label or no. Not only is that part of this forum's mission, but it's also an inherent part of its members and their own philosophies. While me may complain about some nonautistics, you're never gonna see NT-bashing here. Why? Because, like many here have already said, this isn't a "club".

And I'm glad you came back, Civet.

[odeon]

I think you fit in here. And so do the others. It's not about having or not having a dx, and it never was, IMO. If you like it here, like some of the posts, want to reply every now and then, you fit in. And even if you don't really know what to say, but still want to read the posts, you fit in.

I think most of us have experienced that feeling of not belonging, and that, more than a label, is probably what identifies us.